The CHAIRMAN. But you remember distinctly paying Fellrath? Mr. PERICH. Yes, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. How can you distinguish?

Mr. PERICH. We had a new crew in Houston, and we were trying to break them in on that grain business and hold it.

The CHAIRMAN. And so, for that reason you had to rely on Mr. Fellrath, is that the answer?

Mr. PERICH. We had to to a certain extent, yes, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Why did you recruit this new crew?

Mr. PERICH. We had new men; the grain business started up in volume the last few years; we have been in business 35 years.

The CHAIRMAN. But it is the first-you commenced operating in Houston?

Mr. PERICH. We have been paying Christmas gifts in Houston for years.

The CHAIRMAN. How did your volume of business increase in Houston within a matter of a few months so you had to recruit an entire new crew?

Mr. PERICH. We didn't recruit an entirely new crew.

The CHAIRMAN. You said you had all new men up there, so you had to pay Mr. Fellrath a Christmas present because of the services he rendered; and one reason you had to rely on Fellrath was because you had a new crew up there. That is what your testimony was. Mr. PERICH. We had some new men up there.

The CHAIRMAN. Couldn't you have relied on the older men in your crew to assist in teaching your new men what to do without going out and paying such generous bonuses to a Mr. Fellrath?

Mr. PERICH. Repeat that again, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. I don't have to repeat that, sir. I just call it to your personal attention, your own testimony. You said you had to pay Fellrath because Mr. Fellrath was rendering you a service.

Mr. PERICH. Senator, we didn't have to pay him anything.

The CHAIRMAN. But you saw fit and you thought it was a very good business investment to give him this Christmas present not 1 year, but 5 different years, and you constantly increased the amount. Now, the question that occurs to me is: How did it happen that your business became so important and increased so much that you had to increase the staff up there to such an extent that you had all new men or raw recruits, and that you had to depend on Fellrath to assist in getting your business because you had new people up there? That was your own testimony, that you had to rely on Fellrath because you had new people.

Mr. PERICH. We had to rely on him to a certain extent. We had new men up there and he helped us out.

The CHAIRMAN. What percent of the crew was new?

Mr. PERICH. Fifty percent.

The CHAIRMAN. And why did you have to have 50-percent new crew?

Mr. PERICH. There is a big turnover in Houston; we have to get new men. We can't keep employees there like you can here. We are subject to oil-well refineries who work 5 days a week; we work 6 days a week.

The CHAIRMAN. How many people do you employ?

Mr. PERICH. Twenty people.

The CHAIRMAN. And you have a turnover that is such that you have to have Mr. Fellrath assist you in training that personnel? Mr. PERICH. To a certain extent; yes, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. How many new people have you hired this year? Mr. PERICH. I don't know, offhand, six or eight.

The CHAIRMAN. And did you add any to your staff, or was that to fill positions that became vacant?

Mr. PERICH. I think we had 1 or 2 more.

The CHAIRMAN. Did you pay any of your regular employees Christmas bonuses?

Mr. PERICH. Yes, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. Did you pay any of your regular old-time employees Christmas bonuses comparable to what you paid Fellrath?

Mr. PERICH. Senator, our business, Colonel Stone returned from war right after World War II, and we set up a new establishment. Our entire personnel are on a participating basis. We are on a very nominal drawing account salary, and what we make is split up among the personnel. In other words, if we do business, they get compensated, and if we don't they don't.

The CHAIRMAN. But Fellrath is not on such a basis?

Mr. PERICH. No.

The CHAIRMAN. But you could furnish for the record the exact amount of Christmas bonuses that you paid to your regular employees? Mr. PERICH. Yes, sir; that's right.

The CHAIRMAN. Have you such information now?

Mr. PERICH. Yes.

The CHAIRMAN. You mean of the regular employees?

Mr. PERICH. Regular employees of the Stone Forwarding Co. I am talking about.

Mr. GUINANE. We do not have that.

The CHAIRMAN. All right.

Then, you will furnish for the record, because I think it is very important that we know what your turnover is, the number of employees, what the number of employees are, because you have said the reason you had to give Mr. Fellrath this Christmas bonus was to compensate him for the services that he was rendering to you because you had so many new people on your staff.

Mr. PERICH. Yes, sir.

The CHAIRMAN. That was your testimony.

(The information referred to above is as follows:)

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