STATEMENT OF S. V. BACKWORTH, VALLIANT, OKLA. Mr. BACKWORTH. I am S. V. Backworth, from Curton County, Okla. I am a rancher, small rancher. I am living in a section where we have small farmers, peanut raisers, cotton raisers. Our peanut raisers have, considerable amount of them have been retired from the farm due to the fact that their acreage has not been sufficient to make them a living out there. They have 1-acre minimum and they say that if they can get 10 acres that would be a subsistence allotment and would keep them on there with other little things they might raise for their cash crops to support their families and keep them on the farm. The cotton farmer is pretty well satisfied. However, the tenant farmer that is putting the expense into the cotton crop will probably break even this year but when he starts this next year's crop it will be necessary for him to borrow money. Now we are for the support price. We do feel that cattle and hogs. are basic. Wasn't there a law passed to support cattle and hogs? The CHAIRMAN. No. Mr. BACKWORTH. No support price? The CHAIRMAN. No support price for cattle or hogs; only a purchase program with section 32 funds. Mr. BACKWORTH. We feel this about it: If corn, the feed that goes into our livestock, we feel that livestock should be supported along with the things it takes to produce them. We will be satisfied. Thank you. The CHAIRMAN. Thank you. Mr. Mungle? Have you anything new to give us, Mr. Mungle? STATEMENT OF JENE J. MUNGLE, ATOKA, OKLA. Mr. MUNGLE. Senator, one thing we need is a better relationship, public relationship out of the Department of Agriculture. If we are going to continue to subsidize all these other hundreds of other subsidies this Government has and you know they run into the hundreds, why is the farmer having to fight for an unjust cause of 100 percent of parity. Why is the imported dairy product, raw products, you know of them, charged up to the American farmer? They are charged up in the last 10 years, all these imported products have been charged up to the American farmer. Is the import tax on these equal to the tax on the finished product? Gentlemen, we are having to fight for an unjust cause. You know it and I know it. Didn't the Department of Agriculture learn a lot of gravy and a little beef didn't help the American cattleman? Who is going to get the gravy on the pork-buying program? Senator SCHOEPPEL. Might I ask a question: How could the Secretary of Agriculture support cattle prices as such other than in an emergency program? He would need a specific law if he was to support it at 90 percent of parity. Mr. MUNGLE. Why did he tell them they would have to pay 12 cents for some of those canners and commercial products they paid 7 cents for and sold them to the Government? They guarantee the 64440-56-pt. 5-22 packer 6 percent profit. The corporation commission today are filing for public utilities. I will tell you the truth, they have to, they are entitled to a 6 percent profit on their investment. Whom are we going to file with except you gentlemen? I know this State department, some of the deals they got into. I don't like them. Everything I have got, everything that I will ever have I have no connections, I belong to a lot of farm organizations, but everything I have got or will have comes from the farm. Senator SCHOEPPEL. You mentioned something about the tariff situation. Now we have had tariff policies established for years and years. Those are matters under the law and no Secretary of Agriculture, I don't care who he is, can go in and change them without the proper approach being made under the law through the proper department. It rests largely now with the executive department, on certain findings by the Tariff Commission and the Commerce Department. The Secretary of Agriculture has very little to do about that, if any. Mr. MUNGLE. The farmer has not had enough representation in Congress or in any of the state legislatures to cause enough fear in the Congressmen and Senators to get an adequate justification of their rights represented in foreign matters. All other industries have their valuation increase far greater than the farmers. Senator YOUNG. I do not believe there is a single farmer on the Tariff Commission that sets these tariff policies. That is one of the problems. Mr. MUNGLE. That is one of the problems I am driving at. They are not represented. I don't know whether this system of government that we have got ourselves into, you gentlemen have lived longer than I have, if you call it stabilization or subsidization, socialism, or whatever it is, it is not for the good of the people of this country, basically. Senator THYE. I could not disagree with you more. The form of government of the United States of America is the finest government in all the world. There has never been anything recorded in all history that is half as good from the standpoint of serving the people. Here is a nation responsive to its people. We now have an economic problem in agriculture. We are blessed with a surplus, both in food and fiber, beyond what we consume or export. However, do not find fault with this form of government if you expect any sympathy, at least from this side of the table. Mr. MUNGLE. Senator, it is the privilege of every individual to say exactly what he thinks, and I do not believe that the basic form of government we are getting ourselves into, you refer to as the government has been, not as it is today for this individual. Are we taking care of this marginal farmer we have talked about today? The CHAIRMAN. How long have you farmed? Mr. MUNGLE. All my life. I learned how to milk when I was- Mr. MUNGLE. My father and I together have 900. The CHAIRMAN. Nine hundred? Mr. MUNGLE. He started out with one cow. How would I or any other individual start out today that way? The CHAIRMAN. Do you have a dairy? Mr. MUNGLE. Yes. The CHAIRMAN. How big is it; how many cows? Mr. MUNGLE. Today we have around 200 cows. Mr. MUNGLE. Yes. The CHAIRMAN. Are you in a milkshed? Mr. MUNGLE. Twenty cents a quart. The CHAIRMAN. Can you make any money on that? Mr. MUNGLE. In our part of the country, Senator, the pressure from the big concerns is to raise the price. Our income in that locality is so small that I cannot see any justification of trying to punish the consumer any more. The CHAIRMAN. What milkshed do you have? Mr. MUNGLE. It is my own. Senator THYE. To what market do you sell your fluid milk? Senator THYE. You are getting 20 cents a quart. Do you raise your own feed? Mr. MUNGLE. Part of it and part of it we buy. Senator THYE. What part do you raise? Mr. MUNGLE. Only about one-tenth of the year-round basis. We specialize in grazing. Senator THYE. The concentrates, the high proteins, you buy them? Mr. MUNGLE. Yes, sir. Senator THYE. A man who is privileged to have a 200-cow herd and sells fluid milk on a consumers market, if he finds fault with the form of government that this United States gives its people, he rather surprises me. Mr. MUNGLE. Senator, I think we got started off wrong. I will talk to you later about that. The point I am driving at is the big corporations and the labor unions included have dominated everything to an extent, even I as an individual. You gentlemen are to be commended for what you are doing here. We don't want all our basic principles different. We want to stand on our own 2 feet as the American farmer and we want the rest of the United States, the citizens of this country, to stand on their own 2 feet and quit depending on the Government. Senator YOUNG. You mean the farmers would be willing to go it alone if the rest of them would? Mr. MUNGLE. If you throw it open, but if you keep it on one, keep it on all. The CHAIRMAN. Thank you. (Mr. Mungle's prepared statement follows:) To give a little background, I am a dairy farmer from Atoka County, which is located in the southeastern part of Oklahoma. The average farm income is around $289.1 It is getting harder for the average farmer in our county and throughout Oklahoma to make a living. You gentlemen know that it takes a lifetime of good management, hard work, and many other factors to establish oneself in this business of farming. I don't think I will be able to say anything new here today, but I do hope that some basic principles can be accomplished for the betterment of agriculture 1 Net income: Reference, Technical Bulletin No. T-56, issued by Oklahoma A. and M. College, Stillwater, dated September. in our State and Nation. Today the population of the farmers is in the minority but it is in the majority for setting the basis of economy of this country. It is impossible for any one individual to comprehend all of the problems of the diversified field of agriculture. These are my opinions as I, an individual, look at this gigantic problem of the American farmer; not only I but every individual citizen in this great country of ours. Our problems reaches further than the farmer. Today subsidization seems to be the policy of the American philosophy, if we want to call it that. We, the Government, Uncle Sam, Sugar Daddy, do not only subsidize the airlines, railroads, magazines, etc., but you gentlemen know the subsidy list would run into the hundreds. Not only in this country, how many factors and how many other stabilization policies has the Department of Agriculture with the State Department been taken for a sucker in the past 10 years? We cannot win friends on a giveaway program. We may perpetuate someone or party in office. Gentlemen I know that the American farmer and you know that the American farmers are having to fight for an unjust cause. This country cannot subsidize the whole world. Look back and see how many thousands of tons of vegetable oil, wheat, beef, dairy products, and peanuts we have imported into this country in the past 10 years. I would like to present some questions for thought. Should these imported products be charged up against the surplus that has accumulated against the American farmers? Is the importation tax on these products equal to industrial product tax? What is the value of these products against the charge of subsidy to the farmer? Should we force our small farmers and citizens into some other business or into relief lines? Can we continue our handout to the other countries and not take care of our own people? If the program we have had and to have for the good of all the farmers? Didn't the Department of Agriculture learn that a lot of gravy and little beef didn't help the cattlemen? Who is going to get the gravy on the pork program? Has not the average manufacturing industries valuation increased far greater than the average farmer in the past 10 years? What did the Democrats let happen to farm prices during the latter part of their administration? What are the Republicans doing in their administration? Mr. Benson, I believe, is a great individual, but he is letting the American farmer suffer while other subsidization programs continue. I will say this much, if we had more milk salesmen and milk drinkers in our Government instead of some of the vodka drinkers and cocktail guzzlers as in some departments, they would be able to do some sober thinking and planning for the farmers relative to the subsidizing of farm products. You gentlemen, who have been in Washington, know what I mean. We talk about improved marketing and merchandising program. The American dairy farmer is doing a great job of advertising and selling milk. This has come out of his own pocket and has helped to stop the surpluses from accumulating. We want to stand on our own two feet but we cannot carry all of the load. We, as farmers, are forced to fight for 100-percent parity which is our just and rightful share under the system of Government we are now operating. I, for one farmer, do not believe that this trend of subsidized or socialistic form of Government (or whatever you want to call it) that we have and are living under is the right form of government to inspire the individual to stand on his own initiative. We have great farm organizations that are representing us, the American farmer, but if they cannot win the support of Congress and the Government and the people through sound principles and logical thinking instead of through the power of fear like some of the big corporations and labor unions for their selfish interest. This country was not built on fear. I know the more people we get the more complex the problem of Government is, but let us not alter the basic principles of our Government. I like to live better than I can afford but when are we going to have the guts or the intestinal fortitude to stand on our own two feet and quit living off of our grandchildren and great-grandchildren. This Nation was built under God's guidance, and by the work and sweat of your brow ye shall be known. Thank you, gentlemen, for the opportunity you are giving me as the American farmer to express my opinions. This is one of the American ways to solve a problem. Thank you, again. The CHAIRMAN. I am sorry to advise that I have just received this notice, and I will read it. It says the Field House is booked for a performance by Sammy Kaye at 8 o'clock tonight and crews are waiting to set up the hall. That is this hall we are now occupying. It was supposed to have started at 4 o'clock. We were supposed to get out at 4 and it is now 4:40. I am sorry, but we are going to try to listen to you folks here if you have something new, and if not we would appreciate it if all of you would please file your statements with clerk of the committee, who sits on the table here to the left. We would appreciate it very much. All right, Mr. Goebel. This is something we can't stop unless you want to proceed in the street. STATEMENT OF GLADMAN GOEBEL, MILL CREEK, OKLA. Mr. GOEBEL. I am Gladman Goebel. I am a dairyman and farmer. To save time I will back up Mr. Foster's statement and not go into it. But representing the dairymen we have three items. First, we don't want the price of grain supported any lower than the price of dairy products. Second, we think that the processor or dairy is charging too much for handling that milk. I think it went up to $1 to $2 a hundred in the last 3 years. Third, we would like to see a bottle of milk at 4-percent butterfat. We think it would increase the markets for milk. The CHAIRMAN. That has been suggested several times. Mr. Hays. STATEMENT OF JIMMY HAYS, ENID, OKLA. Mr. HAYS. I am Jimmy Hayes, from Enid, Okla., a wheat farmer and cattle farmer. The CHAIRMAN. How long have you lived in Enid? Mr. HAYS. Twenty-four years I have been on a farm. I lived there all my life. The CHAIRMAN. I pitched wheat in Enid 45 years ago as a college student. Mr. HAYS. I am thankful for what program we have left and going downhill. I don't take the attitude of the man a while ago, but I do think the first big step you gentlemen ought to take back in Washington is to enact a rigid 90-percent support that will restore some of our lost prosperity on the farm. We want a big soil conservation program. It isn't the only answer but it will be an additional answer and should be on top of what we have already got, and we need all these angles also. Somebody presented it as almost a utopia. It isn't that but I do believe it is something which we should have in addition to what we now have. It should be for the family-sized farmer. He is the one who needs help to adjust his farming and educate his children. Tenants should be paid well. We should have some kind of a program for the cattle and hogs because it takes more acres for livestock farming |