plies imported from other sources to be distributed in some other

manner.

Our agreement will be very comprehensive in that respect and will include methods, principles, and policies for the distribution of all such supplies.

The agreement would cover the question of ration systems that should be in effect in the country, and price controls. It would provide that there should be no discriminations, no export or diversion of our supplies or other similar supplies during the period of need. It would cover the question of machinery for effective crop collections.

It would cover the question of reports as to information and statistics required by the United States on the handling and distribution of these supplies.

It would cover the freedom of the United States representatives, the press, and radio to observe, inspect, travel, and report without censorship.

It would concern the question of publicity within the country as to the contributions of the United States in this situation and the method and manner in which the supplies were being received and distributed.

The agreement would cover the right of the United States to stop or alter our program of assistance at any time for any reason.

Any other agreements deemed necessary, or any other matters deemed necessary to insure proper conduct or effectiveness of distribution would be included.

I have here a very short memorandum regarding the plans which we have made for the administration of this relief in case the Congress should vote the funds.

At Washington headquarters, we would propose to have a small policy staff which would coordinate the United States relief program. It would be attached to the Office of the Assistant Secretary of State for Economic Affairs.

Also in Washington we would propose to have a small operating division which would keep track of procurement, fiscal and budgetary matters and be responsible for screening and approving operations by recipient countries.

I would like to make clear that it is not intended at all that the Department of State should do any procuring itself. To the extent that procuring may be necessary by the United States Government, it would be done by the usual agencies for that purpose, that is the Department of Agriculture in the case of agricultural products, and the Treasury Department in the case of other products.

The officers in the operating divisions will work closely with procurement officials of the receiving governments.

A staff of trained observers will be stationed in the field, two to four men in each country. They will be responsible for observing distribution and negotiating with the government officials concerning rationing, price controls, disposal of local currency proceeds, and similar matters to insure just and impartial distribution of the United States relief supplies.

The administrative plan will require approximately 25 officers and clerks in the department in Washington, and approximately 28 officers and clerks in the field.

The estimated cost for this staff will be from $500,000 to $700,000 for 1 year.

In other words, it would be a little over one-eighth of 1 percent of the total amount that we are requesting here.

Now, Mr. Chairman, if there are any questions, I will do my best to answer them.

Chairman EATON. The chairman would like to make a statement with reference to the questions:

Our meeting a week ago ended in a confusion, and some of our members had no opportunity to question the witness.

I am very anxious to have every member of this committee given a full opportunity to participate in all of the discussions, to ask questions and receive answers.

From time immemorial it has been the custom of this committee, and I judge in all others, to follow the line of seniority on both sides in the questioning.

Now, a little mathematics may help us: We have 25 members here. The distinguished Secretary for Economic Affairs can figure it out for us if we cannot do it ourselves. If each member takes 5 minutes, that would be 2 hours and 5 minutes on one witness, which ought to involve receiving some information, or misinformation as the case may be.

I was wondering if today we could not put up a limit for each member at 5 minutes and if possible, by Divine guidance, to cut it down to perhaps 2 minutes or 3 minutes.

At any rate, we will try to follow the old-line method, and if it does not work today, I am going to begin at the bottom of the class and work up.

Mr. RICHARDS. Mr. Chairman, while you are on that, why not try the 5-minute method today?

Chairman EATON. That is what I propose.

Mr. RICHARDS. I would say, if we had additional time after we went around the table, we could start again.

Mr. BLOOM. Why do you not alternate? Why not take one from the top and one from the bottom and see how that goes?

Chairman EATON. That is an idea. Would that be agreeable? I do not like the word "bottom" however. We will start at the top with Mr. Vorys.

Mr. VORYS. I have a great many things I would like to find out, and I do not intend to vote on this until I get the answers to all of my questions, and for that reason I would prefer someone else ask the questions at this time.

Mr. BLOOM. I will yield my time to the gentleman from Ohio. You may proceed, Mr. Vorys.

Mr. VORYS. Mr. Clayton, a number of us who remember when the State Department brought UNRRA before us, are now perplexed at the change of viewpoint of the Department on the whole relief matter, that it should not be handled internationally, and should be confined solely to relief needs.

I wondered when you mentioned that 57 percent of the needs are covered by the estimates, does that include the countries you have named, or the total relief needs?

Mr. CLAYTON. It includes relief for only the countries I have named. These are the countries which we believe have the most pressing need. Mr. VORYS. How many people are in need of relief in countries devastated by the war on the basis of calories, or any other basis that you would estimate?

Mr. CLAYTON. I just do not know the population of all these countries, Mr. Vorys.

All the countries we have named are in need of relief, obviously. There will always be some people in every country that are able to look out for themselves, by one method or another, but the great bulk of the people in these countries are in need of relief.

Mr. VORYS. We had planned to spend $2,173,000,000 up to June, and $1,200,000,000 next year for relief, according to the budget. Do you know how that would be proportioned?

Mr. CLAYTON. You must refer to the military programs. I know of no relief programs outside of UNRRA and this resolution here.

I suppose what you have reference to are the military programs for Germany and for Japan.

They are really not relief items. They are military programs for civilian affairs. They are more than relief. They are much more comprehensive than relief programs."

Mr. VORYS. I am just taking it from the President's budget under the heading of "Relief."

I think we must get a picture and present it to Congress as to what the total relief load is as proposed by the President in his budget. We must learn how many people it is going to affect throughout the world.

Mr. CLAYTON. The only relief program with which I have anything to do or the Department of State has directly to do with is this one that we are considering now.

These other large sums that you have mentioned, as I have said, I feel quite sure are in the Army and Navy budgets for civilian affairs in what they call "Disease and unrest programs" and more than that, in the countries where the American armies are in occupation.

Mr. VORYS. Do you have representatives on UNRRA?

Mr. CLAYTON. Yes, sir.

Mr. VORYS. How much have we still to spend on UNRRA?

Mr. CLAYTON. At the end of the year, the total supplies unshipped by UNRRA was approximately $600,000,000, of which about $350,000,000 was to come from the United States. That was as of the end of 1946, but the total amount is committed and the supplies are moving rapidly now. The program will soon be finished in Europe.

Mr. VORYS. I understood there was some limitation on the use of our funds for shipment as of 1947. Is that correct?

Mr. CLAYTON. No, sir: there is no absolute limitation by legislation or otherwise of which I am aware prior to the expiration of the appropriation on June 30, 1947.

We had indicated when we came before the Congress for the last appropriation, that the target was to complete the shipments to Europe

1

1

by the end of 1946 and the shipments to Asia by the end of the first quarter in 1947.

Due to all kinds of delays such as coal strikes and shipping strikes, we were not able to reach that target.

The whole program should be practically completed for Europe by shipments which will be largely completed by the end of March and early April.

For the Far East they will be completed sometime in July or August.

Mr. VORYS. Then in addition to the $500,000,000 of UNRRA products yet undelivered by UNRRA, I understand that $100,000,000 of this $350,000,000 to be authorized by this legislation would be the amount distributed up to June. Is that correct?

Mr. CLAYTON. That depends on how soon this $350,000,000 would be available to us if at all, by Congress, and how quickly we could enter the procurement. The critical time, as I have said in my previous statement, is in the spring and summer before the harvest come in. Therefore we would like to get the money as quickly as we can and start shipping wheat and other supplies as quickly as possible.

Mr. VORYS. I noted in the Budget that $100,000,000 of that was put in for fiscal year 1947.

Mr. CLAYTON. That is just an estimate, sir. We would like to spend more than that if we could in the fiscal

year

1947.

Mr. VORYS. According to the Budget, you would contemplate that $250,000,000 would be distributed through 1948?

Mr. CLAYTON. That is the estimate we made; yes, sir.

Mr. VORYS. We were told when UNRRA was presented to us, that the problem would be for the first crop year after the war, and that is running into the third crop year. You must study how permanent this problem is going to be.

Mr. CLAYTON. Mr. Vorys, you will note that we are asking for only about 10 percent of the whole UNRRA program. As I have said in my statement, we believe that this should finish the job for all countries except possibly Austria.

Mr. VORYS. Does this include taking care of the million displaced persons and refugees?

Mr. CLAYTON. No, sir; that has nothing to do with that.

Mr. VORYS. This food would not go to take care of them?

Mr. CLAYTON. That is included in other figures you mentioned a moment ago.

Mr. VORYS. Does the resolution contemplate private and voluntary relief that is going into these countries?

Mr. CLAYTON. It contemplates that that will continue to some extent, but we can only guess how much. It has been very substantial. It runs up close to $700,000,000, I am informed, for private relief in these countries.

Mr. VORYS. Have facilities now been made so that private relief and individual relief such as CARE can be delivered throughout Europe? Mr. CLAYTON. I understand that organizations like CARE are doing a pretty good business and packages are going regularly and are being delivered.

Mr. VORYS. Thank you very much.

Chairman EATON. Mr. Bloom.

Mr. BLOOM. I have no questions.
Chairman EATON. Mr. Mundt.

Mr. MUNDT. Mr. Clayton, what is the date that you think UNRRA will be completed and the people removed from the pay roll?

Mr. CLAYTON. It will take quite some little time to wind up all the accounts, and completely liquidate it and close the books, but the active operations of UNRRA should be practically finished for shipments to Europe by the end of March, or perhaps sometime in April.

UNRRA has missions in all of these recipient countries, and it would be necessary to keep them there until the supplies are distributed and then of course the problem of closing the books, with the audits and everything that has to be done for an organization that did a $3,500,000,000 business will take a little time.

Mr. MUNDT. If Congress acts expeditiously on this, it seems that the flow of relief from this act will take place while the UNRRA is still going on. Will the UNRRA missions be used?

Mr. CLAYTON. We may be able to pick one or two of the best men in UNRRA to joint this staff that I have spoken about here, but the missions themselves will not be used. It is not necessary.

Mr. MUNDT. There would be positively no use of the UNRRA missions abroad in this relief?

Mr. CLAYTON. No, sir; not in this. We would not have use for them.

Mr. MUNDT. On page 4, you say that other countries are likewise helping at this time. You mentioned Great Britain. Can you tell what other countries have indicated that they are going to chip in and help?

Mr. CLAYTON. We have had discussions with several of the countries, Mr. Mundt. Of course, I cannot speak for them, and I do not want to embarrass the representatives of any other countries, but I think I might tell you that we have had several discussions with the Canadians.

The gentlemen with whom we have discussed the matter have been very sympathetic and they are thinking about it. I know that other countries who are in position to ship certain kinds of supplies have been approached on the matter, and we are very hopeful that if and when we are given this money by Congress we can sit down and actively discuss the matter with other countries. They will know what we are prepared to do and we can explore that situation with them and see what they are willing to do for each individual country. Some of them will have more interest in some of these recipient countries than they will others, and for that reason it is necessary for us to keep our flexible about the amounts that we would have to employ in each country, depending upon what other supplying countries will have in mind.

Mr. MUNDT. The reason I asked, there will probably be about $300,000,000 worth of relief which must be supplied by other countries. Mr. CLAYTON. We figure about $260,000,000, and this may not all be supplied. We have indicated there that the British are proposing to put up $40,000,000 in Austria and I think there is a pretty good