Mr. PONDER. It is a pleasure. Thank you.

Mr. EVANS. We are very fortunate, I think, in being able to move along in these hearings so that we have an opportunity at this time to have some input from the local community with someone we have not previously had listed as a witness.

I think that the main thrust of this committee's concern when it is boiled down to its really basic elements is that we are concerned about the young people in this country, and we are concerned about people being subjected to drug usage or the temptation of drug usage in experimentation before our young people obtain the maturity to make an intelligent decision.

And we are concerned that these people are not having access to the facts about drug abuse and its effect on their long-term health and really what they are going to do with the rest of their lives.

We have a parent here who is coming forth this morning to testify about some personal experiences in this area. And I think it would be a good contribution to these hearings. I will ask Mr. Brian Reid to come forward.

Mr. Reid, I will ask you to raise your right hand if you will.

[Mr. Reid was sworn by Mr. Evans.]

Mr. EVANS. All right, sir, if you would state your name and where you live, please.

TESTIMONY OF BRIAN T. REID, WESTSIDE, GA.

Mr. REID. Brian T. Reid, Westside, Ga.

First of all, I will tell you a little bit about my family. I have a daughter and three sons. The younger son is 13 years old. My oldest son is 20. My middle son is 18. My daughter is 22. She was just married recently.

The reason I am bringing out that she was married recently is because she suffers from epilepsy. When she was a young girl 13, 14, 15, she was introduced into the drug society, along with my two oldest boys. Because of this, my daughter of course, it is purely speculative on my side, but I believe it is true-suffers from epilepsy from smoking marihuana and possibly taking other drugs.

My sons started smoking marihuana when they were 12 and 14, maybe 15 years old, which at the time, I did not know because these things came on so gradually that it took quite a while for us to realize +hat they were on drugs. They obtained the drugs from a boy from California. And right now, I can't think of his name. He was a known criminal who had been pushing marihuana before. And he introduced these young boys, and it was his idea that once he got a string of boys tied up on marihuana, then he could use them for robbing stores and things like that.

And that is exactly what happened. One day, he got my oldest son drunk on marihuana and whiskey, and they went out to one of the local filling stations and broke in. My son got 2 years' probation for stealing a bottle of Coca-Cola. And, of course, he is still tied up in drugs.

My family has always, my home has always, been an open center to all teenagers in the neighborhood. We have had as many as 20

teenagers parked in the front yard at one time. And all of them would be smoking pot in my front yard. Of course, I won't let them in my home because they knew my feelings about pot. And I would raise holy hell when they came anywhere near the house with the drug.

I was raised in Chicago most all my life so I know exactly what the effects of pot would do. I have seen friends of mine. I have one friend now that is in a mental institution because he started smoking pot. And so I have done my best to try to convince these boys that smoking pot is wrong. But they get these magazines, "Easy Rider," and I can't think of all the names, glamorizing pot, there is nothing wrong, even advertisements. They don't call it pot in their magazines, but they call it love drugs and love grass and all kinds of other weird names that all these drugs are perfectly legal and perfectly nice to take. They won't hurt you; they make you feel good.

But my idea is if you can put out $100 million here tomorrow on drug enforcement, it is still going to be around. You cannot stop it by law enforcement. The only way that you can ever stop drugs is by education. That is the reason I don't smoke because when I was small in a private school in Chicago, the first thing they did when we were in sixth grade was come along and tell us what pot was. They showed us pot; they showed us exactly what it would do to us and everything else.

From then on, I was scared to death of the stuff. I wouldn't get near it. And all these "Easy Riders" telling these boys there is nothing wrong with it and the stories coming up on the news saying they are using it for medicine and stuff like that, they say, "Well, I will never have cataracts; I am smoking pot." And away they go.

But you can't explain to them that pot will not cure the cataracts. I am not against pot; don't get me wrong. I am not against pot for purposes of drugs. Alcohol is one of the worst drugs. It has been used ever since long before the Bible. But we control it. We tell the children exactly what it is. We control it. They know.

Of course, there is still a lot of them going to get drunk, but that is not the point I am bringing across now. The point is we do not have any program whatsoever telling these children that pot is wrong and will hurt them. There is no program in the school. Occasionally, they may come up once every 2, 3 years and tell the children, "Don't touch pot, we will spank your little bottom end," and that is it.

Mr. EVANS. Could we ask some questions

Mr. REID. Please do so.

Mr. EVANS [continuing]. About some of the information that you are providing us?

I would like to find out where your children went to school. Where did they go to school?

Mr. REID. They went to the Jones County public schools and also Genesco Academy in Jones County.

Mr. EVANS. Was it your experience at that time, after you found out they were using marihuana and other drugs, that they were available at the schools?

Mr. REID. This I knew all along.

Mr. EVANS. How did you find out, or how do you know it was being distributed at the schools?

Mr. REID. My children told me so. Not in words, "Well, I bought it down there at the school," but in actions and roundabout ways; they told me that they could obtain it anywhere they wanted to.

Mr. EVANS. The experience with your daughter-has your family had any history of epilepsy either on your side or your wife's side of the family?

Mr. REID. None whatsoever. Well, I take that back. I think one of my wife's cousins has epilepsy, but on my mother's and father's side, there is no known case that I know of.

Mr. EVANS. So that what you are basically concerned with is the easy availability of pot and other illegal substances; is that correct? Mr. REID. More so the education.

Mr. EVANS. And lack of education?
Mr. REID. The lack of education.

Mr. EVANS. To advise. This is the point that we were making earlier, that there is no way for a young person to make an intelligent decision about whether or not to experiment with drugs because of the lack of a comprehensive educational program that will tell both sides of the issue. Is that your feeling?

Mr. REID. That's right. It should be a necessity in school from the time they are in first grade all the way until they graduate to have at least several hours every month with a film or some kind of way to explain to the child that regardless of what kind of drug it is, alcohol, or any other kind of drug, what can actually happen to that child if he gets ahold of the drug.

Mr. EVANS. Well, when you found out that your children were using drugs, what education, if any, did you provide them? Or what did you do?

The thing that bothered me was your statement about being an open house for the teenagers in the neighborhood and that they were using pot, but you wouldn't let them bring it in the house. Did you do anything to discourage them from using it other than talking to them? Ŏr did you do anything to try to bring any of the local community agencies to bear on them?

Mr. REID. The main thing that I have tried to do with the children— and maybe in one or two cases, I have helped a little bit because I have slowed down the traffic in my own children, if nothing else that I have tried to show them articles. I have taken articles out of the paper and pasted them on the wall. I have talked to my children and tried to explain to them what the dangers of pot have been. And we have had some knock-down, drag-out arguments about the use of pot.

Mr. EVANS. Don't you have just as many articles advocating the use of it or the decriminalization of it as you do those that point out the harmful effects?

Mr. REID. Yes, sir, we do. And that is one of the things-the thing, the point-that should be brought across. If we can get a company for false advertising, why can't we stop a magazine from pushing an article that is false advertising?

Mr. EVANS. Well, I think it is called first amendment rights.

Mr. REID. Well, then, that is still false advertisement. He is telling a wrong view of something, a view that is absolutely wrong.

things like tranquilizers and the like, become very, very dangerous substances. I don't care who says that they are not.

We have found that the interaction, the chemical interaction, that exists is a danger to the health, and it is a danger to the safety of the people. The advocates of the use of marihuana, those people often say, "Well, you know, most people take a cocktail when they come home at night." Well, the single cocktail is not as disorienting as a single joint. People can take a cocktail and even with the drunkometer or whatever those machines are that they use to test for the alcohol in the blood, they are not disoriented the way they are disoriented when they smoke a joint.

For young people to smoke marihuana while they are driving or before they drive is something that is a danger to the health and safety of others as well.

Mr. REID. I have read somewhere if you take a drink of alcohol, the alcohol is completely gone from your system within 12 hours. In marihuana, it takes 24 hours or longer to disappear.

Mr. WOLFF. I might tell you concerning the THC that is in marihuana, that medical evidence has proven the fact that it takes 5 to 6 days for the THC in the marihuana to be dissipated.

Mr. REID. That's what I meant to say, 5 or 6 days. That was a slip of the tongue in there. But these drugs will just not leave the system. They stay there.

Mr. WOLFF. Marihuana is accumulated in the fatty tissue of the body. That is why there is disorientation. The brain is a fatty tissue. That's why they say a lot of people are fatheads.

Thank you.

Mr. EVANS. Thank you, Mr. Wolff.

Mr. Coughlin?

Mr. COUGHLIN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I want to join in certainly expressing our appreciation for your coming forward and expressing your feelings in this. And I totally agree with you in your belief in the importance of drug-abuse education.

And I guess my only single question is: Is there a drug-abuse education system in the school in your district?

Mr. REID. My youngest son said they have come around occasionally, but it is totally insufficient for what it should be. And I think that there should be much more heavier emphasis, and the education system should go beyond the school for anybody caught smoking pot. This is the one point that I want to bring across.

A young boy should not be criminalized because he is smoking pot. I don't think he should be made a criminal. But he should be challenged if only in the manner that is required to take a course in drug abuse. And this way, he will not have a bad name the rest of his life.

But if he takes this course, it has worked with alcohol, with drunken drivers, it should work with marihuana and drugs. And if it helps only two or three, it has paid for itself.

Mr. COUGHLIN. I suggest that one of the things you can do, and it would be very important to do, is work with your parent-teachers association or whatever facility you have for obtaining input into the school system in Georgia to try to improve the drug abuse education

One of the big points that I find in all of this is the fact that more and more young people in the very formative ages of life, in the preteens, are now abusing this substance. They are being introduced to it, marihuana particularly, and marihuana and booze, a combination of the two. I think that, regardless of how a young adult who has reached maturity feels about it, I think it is a disgrace to permit the exploitation of the young people in their early stages of life because it does have permanent effect upon them for the rest of their lives.

Of course, this is the growing stages. They are not able to utilize the educational opportunities that are afforded them in the proper fashion. And during the period of growth, whether it be physical or psychological growth, they have to have whatever help they can be given in order to be able to properly develop during that period.

How old were your youngsters when they were first introduced to marihuana?

Mr. REID. As far as I can ascertain, they were in their early teens, 12, 13, 14 years old. The exact date or time, it is very difficult to know because we really only had suspicions of it when they were about 16 years old.

Mr. WOLFF. It really amazes me, the fact that here we have the Surgeon General coming out and talking about tobacco, saying it may be harmful to your health. There is not too much coming out from the Surgeon General about marihuana being harmful to your health.

Mr. REID. That's one of the points I wanted to bring across. Uncle Sam will take one hand, and being an exfarmer, I can appreciate it, he will give the farmer millions of dollars for subsidies in tobacco, then turn around and on the other hand say, "If you smoke tobacco, you will be hurt," and the only advertisement on television to know about marihuana is a simple ad that says, "If you want to get out of the drug scene come and see us.'

It doesn't say anything else, and it is stupid.

Mr. WOLFF. Basically, I think it is about time we really told it. As the language of the street says "told it like it is."

Mr. REID. Right.

Mr. WOLFF. The fact is that there is harm from smoking marihuana. There is harm from using any type of substance, whether it be alcohol, tobacco, anything else like that. To say that it is harmless is the thing that troubles me most. To say that, well, it is as harmless as smoking a cigarette, and here we have members on both sides of me smoking cigarettes. Now, it is their prerogative to do it, but it is not their prerogative to come out and say it is less harmful than marihuana or marihuana is less harmful than the cigarettes.

I think that we should alert the public. And that point that you make, I think, is most important. As parents that we should educate the young people to the dangers that they face in the use and abuse of these various substances.

The one problem that we face that is more important than anything else is the counteraction of the drugs that are available today with the other substances. Booze and marihuana, booze and other types of