Изображения страниц
PDF
EPUB

CONSIDERATION OF THE COMMITTEE

OVERSIGHT PLAN

TUESDAY, FEBRUARY 14, 1995

HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES,

COMMITTEE ON INTERNATIONAL RELATIONS,

Washington, DC.

The committee met, pursuant to call, at 10:24 a.m. in room 2172, Rayburn House Office Building, Hon. Benjamin A. Gilman (chairman of the committee) presiding.

Chairman GILMAN. The committee will come to order. Gentlemen and ladies, take your seats, please.

The committee meets today in open session to consider its oversight plan for the 104th Congress.

As you know, the committees of the House have historically exercised "watchful oversight" over the functions of the executive branch, although specific committees' interest and involvement has waxed and waned over time.

With regard to international relations, oversight is particularly important. Since direct legislative control over the executive is necessarily difficult. In addition, many details of our relations with foreign nations must remain confidential. But the Congress, as the public's representative, is still responsible for ensuring that the executive's action and the conduct of these sensitive relations reflect the public's will.

The House rule mandating the adoption of an oversight plan was adopted on January 4. The new rule is intended to mandate that all committees look ahead and consider their oversight responsibilities, and to allow the House leadership to consider the adequacy of those plans, and suggest any appropriate coordination.

Upon adopting a plan, we will send it forward to the Committees on Government Reform and Oversight and House Oversight. The Committee on Government Reform and Oversight will consult with the Speaker, the majority leader, and the minority leader, and will report to the House our oversight plan, and the other oversight plans, and any recommendations that it may have to ensure effective coordination of our oversight.

This document obviously reflects an ambitious agenda. Our intention was to be as inclusive as possible within the broad limits. of our jurisdiction and of the concept of oversight.

The committee and its subcommittees are not precluded from undertaking additional oversight efforts, nor are they limited to working in a hearing format. All kinds of oversight are permitted and encouraged, as far as I am concerned.

(1)

In addition, the plan does not spell out which activities are to be undertaken by the full committee, and which by the subcommittees. This will be a matter of coordination between the full committee and subcommittee chairmen in consultation with the appropriate ranking minority members.

We have been in touch informally and formally with the minority from which we receive valuable input, and which I very much appreciate. The majority and minority staffs negotiated a series of changes. The document now before you reflects, in all essential respects, the agreement reached between the staffs.

Members have before them today the draft oversight plan of the forthcoming Congress, which is now in order to discuss. My intention would be to recognize members beginning with our ranking minority member, Mr. Hamilton, for comments.

We have agreed that at the conclusion of this meeting that we will forward the plan with any revisions necessary to reflect our discussion today, and for additional technical or grammatical changes to the appropriate committees.

Mr. Hamilton.

[The prepared statement of Hon. Benjamin A. Gilman appears in the appendix.]

Mr. HAMILTON. Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman. I want to thank you for calling this meeting, and for giving us the opportunity to review the oversight plan. I think that the proposal to have oversight plans is a good one. And I do want to express my appreciation to you and your staff for your willingness to consult carefully with the minority with respect to the oversight plan. I think that process, as you have described it, has gone rather well. We have before us a very extensive oversight plan. I think that I have a question or two about it, which I will pose. I do not know if you want that now or at a later point.

Mr. GILMAN. Yes, feel free.

Mr. HAMILTON. The central thing that I am interested in is to get a sense of your own priorities, priority issues for this session of the Congress. There are so many subjects listed in the oversight plan. I think that we will get to most of them, and maybe all of them, in the course of the year.

But can you give us a sense of what your own priorities are with respect to the oversight?

Mr. GILMAN. Well, thank you, Mr. Hamilton. I will try to respond. I think that some of our immediate priorities should be the consideration of the Department of State bill, the foreign aid bill, and any reforms that may be necessary. I will be asking our subcommittees to orient their activities in the near future toward consideration of issues that are implicated in those two bills.

In addition, we will also be convening meetings of the full committee to review issues relating to Europe and to the Middle East. We will be consulting with the ranking Democratic member on other items from this agenda. We should be considering in the near term the full committee by the full committee staff.

Mr. HAMILTON. Mr. Chairman, let me say that I think it is important, especially since the full committee has jurisdiction of Middle East and European matters, that we have hearings. There are a lot of developments in both of those regions, as you well know.

And I am pleased to note that you intend to hold, at least as I understand it, one hearing a month on developments in either Europe or the Middle East.

I commend you for that. I think it is very important that we do that at the full committee level, so I am pleased to hear that. Mr. GILMAN. We will try to adhere to that schedule.

Are there other comments?

Mr. MORAN. Mr. Chairman.
Mr. GILMAN. Mr. Moran.

Mr. MORAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

There is an issue that I would hope that this committee would look into. And that is the issue of mutual extradition treaties. To give you an example, in Arlington, right across the river, we have four cases of people who have committed very serious felonies. In one case, a cold blooded murder; and in another case, a hit and run of a little 3-year-old girl. They are El Salvadorans. And they have gone back to El Salvador, and thus escaped any threat of prosecution for these crimes.

We checked with these other jurisdictions just in Northern Virginia, and it turns out that every jurisdiction had several cases of felonies on the books that have never been prosecuted because El Salvador does not allow anyone to be extradited for prosecution. And it is impossible to get witnesses down there to translate the material. And in fact, in a country like El Salvador until very recently, they really did not have a credible criminal justice system. When we give countries like this substantial sums of foreign aid, there really ought to be some type of extradition agreement, so that serious felonies can in fact be prosecuted. And I do not know that we have ever looked into this situation. We do not even collect data on how serious it is, but I know that El Salvador is not the only country where people can escape prosecution by going back to their country after committing a crime.

So I would hope that we could have some oversight into this issue, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. GILMAN. I think that the gentleman raises a good point, and I am going to ask our staff to try to arrange an appropriate time to discuss this within the committee.

Mr. MORAN. So we could include it within our oversight agenda? Mr. GILMAN. Yes. We can take a look at whatever needs to be done to have a more effective extradition proceeding. In the past, we tried to tie it to some of the narcotics problems that we have had out there. But I think that it is appropriate that we consider that. I thank the gentleman.

Mr. MORAN. I thank the chairman.

Mr. GILMAN. Mr. McNulty.

Mr. MCNULTY. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have a proposal for an addition on page 5 with regard to the U.S. policy toward Syria. There is no mention there of terrorism. And I would hope that we could include at least an additional sentence expressing our continued concern for Syria's history as a haven for terrorists, and as a supporter of terrorist activities around the world.

Mr. GILMAN. If I might bring to the gentleman's attention, in the section on terrorism, there is some notation with regard to Syria. But I think that the gentleman made an appropriate comment. We

certainly should include that, and we will make certain that it is included.

Mr. MCNULTY. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. ROTH. Mr. Chairman.

Mr. GILMAN. Mr. Roth.

Mr. ROTH. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. Chairman, let me compliment you on this plan. I have had a chance, as others have, to review this plan. And the oversight plan is a very important one. Under international economic policy and trade, we have 11 different areas. And I want to assure the chairman that we are going to be looking at oversight and reporting back to the full committee. So that within the timeframe that is given to us, we can complete this mission.

Mr. GILMAN. Thank you, Mr. Roth. We certainly will abide by that.

Mr. Hastings.

Mr. HASTINGS. Mr. Chairman, while I have absolutely no disagreement, and compliment you and the staff for the preparation of this oversight draft, on page 2 where you talk about Rogue Regimes, under 2(c), it is indicated that our focus will turn to that area in the fall of 1996.

And while I recognize and would hope that none of this is necessarily chiseled in stone, such that you have to live by any fixed date, it would seem to me with the developments in the world and with reference to Rogue Regimes, and the fact that many of them are developing nuclear weapons and other methods of mass destruction, I would hope that we could somewhere along the line move that to the front burner a little bit quicker than it does appear for the fall of 1996.

Additionally, Mr. Chairman, and I just ask for information, there is nothing in the oversight draft regarding foreign travel of committee members. And I do not know whether the rule prohibits it, or whether or not we would not put such in an oversight draft. But I want the Chair to know, and other members, particularly new members, that the most beneficial experiences that I had came about as a result of traveling with Members of Congress to locales and learning firsthand what was going on in those specific arenas. There are some that have a total disagreement with that, and I think that they are shortsighted. And I do believe that it would be helpful somewhere if we indicated that there was going to be travel.

Mr. GILMAN. I thank the gentleman for his comment. We have sent out within the last week a memorandum on foreign travel. There are no major prohibitions, but we do encourage that there be a member of both the majority and minority on any mission, and that a report be issued immediately following that, so that the entire committee would have the benefit of your findings.

If you would just take a look at the memo. Those are the guide. lines that we are suggesting on foreign travel. We certainly do urge our members to take advantage of any recess period when they can go out and explore the problems firsthand. There is an old Chinese expression that if you travel horseback, you cannot smell the flowers. And one picture is worth a thousand words. But one trip to some important areas can be very beneficial to the entire commit

tee, especially, if you share your views and findings with the entire committee.

Thank you, Mr. Hastings.

Are there any further comments?

Mr. PAYNE. Mr. Chairman.

Mr. GILMAN. Mr. Payne.

Mr. PAYNE. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

You certainly have done an outstanding job in listing many, many problems. It is difficult to tell whether the manner in which they come and the order of their category is the weightedness of it, or whether you have not prioritized any.

But I would just like to have you consider one other item in the area of international operations and human rights. There has been some concern and additional talk about the problem concerning slavery that has been verified in Mauritania, and is potentially in existence in the Sudan.

And I would just wonder if you would consider having that put in the list. I think that we have never had a hearing on that subject, and it is something that I would just like to add to your list. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Mr. GILMAN. Mr. Payne, I think that is an appropriate suggestion. I will ask our staff to include it.

Mr. SMITH. Mr. Chairman, if I could be heard on that as well. Mr. GILMAN. Mr. Smith.

Mr. SMITH. I thank the gentleman for his recommendation. And I have spoken to people. I even know people who work in Mauritania, who have told me of these kinds of things occurring. And I think that it would be very helpful for the subcommittee to do that. And I thank you for the suggestion.

Mr. BERMAN. Mr. Chairman.

Mr. GILMAN. Mr. Berman.

Mr. BERMAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

This is a little off point. But this is on the bill that you will be managing, The National Security Revitalization Act.

Is that coming up now tonight, or today rather than tomorrow? Mr. GILMAN. I would hope that we keep our thoughts about this measure before us. But I have been informed that the rule may very well start this evening with a general debate following it for an hour or two this evening, and then tomorrow, it is scheduled for tomorrow for general debate, and for amendments.

Mr. BERMAN. So the preprinting of amendments could still take place tonight in the record, so that they would have preference tomorrow?

Mr. GILMAN. That is my understanding, and the preprinting is for preferential consideration of any of the amendments. Ms. RosLehtinen.

Ms. ROS-LEHTINEN. Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman.

Getting back to Mr. Payne's comment, Congressman Zimmer has in fact filed a bill on this issue. And it is one of those very important topics that we were going to schedule a hearing on. So I thank the gentleman for bringing that up.

Mr. GILMAN. I thank the gentlelady.

Are there any further comments with regard to the oversight document?

« ПредыдущаяПродолжить »