Secretary DULLES. The problem of India is a very difficult one. Your committee, under Congressman Merrow, went out there and they probably have some ideas on that which are as good as or better than mine. I hope to go out there myself and possibly come back with some better ideas.

The Indian program to which we would be contributing is primarily an economic program designed to increase the agricultural capacity of the country through improved waterways, irrigation, and the like, and there is no military or political tie-up in that connection. I doubt whether that would be practical at the present time.

Mr. BENTLEY. Are the economic grants based upon putting those countries in a defensible position against the Communist menace? Secretary DULLES. That is generally the case, but I would say India is somewhat of an exception.

Mr. BENTLEY. Thank you, Mr. Secretary.

Mr. ZABLOCKI. I would like to pursue the statement on boondoggling and also the one on the future policy of colonialism.

Secretary DULLES. I would be glad to try to supply that. I would ask the committee to be considerate of the fact that I am leaving on Saturday for the Far East, and I have spent almost all of the past week at congressional hearings and I have a little homework to do. Mr. ZABLOCKI. Could we then have a statement of particular instances of boondoggling in our aid program for our files, Mr. Secretary?

Secretary DULLES. I believe the expenditure of approximately $61 million in Germany for the press and information service in 1952 is an illustration of an expenditure which was quite out of line.

(The following statement has been submitted for the record:)

This program was reduced to about $29,000,000 for 1953, and reduced again to about $21,000,000, which Mr. Dodge, after careful review, approved for 1954. This means that the program is being brought into line. The $61,000,000 figure for 1952, of course, is in reference to my belief that the program was out of line in the past.

Chairman CHIPERFIELD. Mr. Crawford will make an announcement about the committee's next meeting.

Mr. CRAWFORD. The next meeting of the committee will be at 2:30 o'clock this afternoon. Because of the extremely poor acoustics in this room it will not be held here as originally scheduled, but in the committee's meeting room in the Capitol, room G-3.

The meeting will be in executive session with the Director for Mutual Security, the Honorable Harold E. Stassen.

Chairman CHIPERFIELD. The committee stands adjourned.

(Whereupon, at 12: 10 p. m., the committee adjourned to reconvene in executive session at 2: 30 p. m., the same day.)

MUTUAL SECURITY ACT EXTENSION

AFTERNOON SESSION

The committee met in executive session, pursuant to call, in room G-3, United States Capitol, at 3: 10 p. m., Hon. Robert B. Chiperfield (chairman) presiding.

Chairman CHIPERFIELD. The committee will come to order.

Mr. Stassen has indicated that he has no further statement, but he would be glad to answer questions.

Mr. Vorys, do you want to start in?

STATEMENT OF HON. HAROLD E. STASSEN, DIRECTOR FOR MUTUAL SECURITY

Mr. VORYS. Mr. Stassen, we were interested in your statement of yesterday.

When you were up here informally last week we were told we would receive the reports of the evaluation teams and we have not gotten

them.

I understood we were to get them by last Friday. I have seen three of them and I haven't seen any more and I haven't seen any overall report.

How soon are we to get those?

Mr. STASSEN. I believe there are more of them coming up today, and my teams will all be in here tomorrow to go over the report and to learn about what we have done about the reports; so you ought to get them all quite promptly.

I think you have, as of last Friday, France, Germany, and Greece. Mr. VORYS. By "quite promptly," what would you have in mind? Mr. STASSEN. I would think that you ought to have them all by Monday.

Mr. VORYS. Now, as I understand, you have no recommendations with reference to the organization or administration of the Mutual Security Program involved in this legislation at all, with one possible slight exception. Isn't that correct?

Mr. STASSEN. That is correct.

Mr. VORYS. On January 31, 1953, I understand that you had a total of 52,199-you didn't, but your agency had 52,199 personnel, and on January 31, 1952, you had 46,078. That is about 6,121 more this year. On the other hand, as I understand it, we have received information that reductions in certain categories added up to 1,046, a 9.4 percent reduction in certain strength in certain categories, in compliance with the so-called Ribicoff amendment. So during a period which was not identified by the report I have here, 1,046 went off, but there was a total gain of 6,121.

Under the proposals that you have before us here-well, there is $36 million, I think, for administration-what do you expect your employees to be, say, January 1, 1954?

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Mr. STASSEN. It will be considerably less. I would hesitate to put an exact figure on it.

The situation has been this: The Paris, France, MSA office is now in the process of carrying out an order to come down to less than half of its previous size, that is, the size when I took office, in personnel.

The Special Representative, Europe, office, is in the process of a reorganization that will, I feel, bring that down to half the size.

Nearly every European country mission is on its way down in size, but it is not possible right now to say what that total will be because it will also be affected by such things as what the Congress decides to do in the Benton-Moody program, which affects part of our personnel, and what it is decided in the case of information services.

It would be anticipated from some of the discussions that certain informational responsibilities would leave MSA and be placed elsewhere for more effective handling.

However, I would say this, that it is our established policy, which my entire staff knows, that we will administer this program with the smallest possible number of the most competent attainable employees overseas, because of our conviction that large numbers tend to defeat our very objectives in this matter of Americans overseas.

Mr. VORYS. Now, one more question. While you are away, who will be speaking for you?

Mr. STASSEN. The Acting Director will be Mr. William Rand, who is the former president of Monsanto Chemical Co., a former overseer at Harvard, and a man who I checked up on very exhaustively before I appointed him.

I am convinced that he has an exceptional grasp of world economic and defense problems and has extraordinary executive ability to follow through in the kind of administration that I feel we should have in President Eisenhower's Mutual Security Program.

He will further be supported. My other deputies and major assistants are these:

Mr. C. Tyler Wood, who has been in the program a number of years. He is the deputy in charge of congressional liaison.

Dr. D. A. FitzGerald, who is a man of many years experience as an economist and who served extensively with President Hoover in his special food surveys and who has had experience in MSA. I have made him deputy in charge of operations.

Mr. Robert Matteson, who is exceptionally good, I feel, in research and analysis and who was with me at the university, is my assistant in charge of research assistance and reports.

Mr. John Ohly, who had experience in the Department of Defense under Mr. Forrestal and in other departments, is my deputy in charge of programing.

Then, of course, there will be officials from the Department of Defense who are concerned, and the Department of State, who will further be involved.

Mr. VORYS. But the ones who will be speaking for you, as I understand, will be Mr. Wood and Dr. FitzGerald. Will we have Mr. Matteson and Mr. Ohly here?

Mr. STASSEN. They are available, as are any of our staff if you get into particular countries or statistical situations.

Mr. VORYS. Thank you very much.

Mr. STASSEN. Mr. Rand will be in charge in any question of responsibility.

Chairman CHIPERFIELD. Mr. Richards.

Mr. RICHARDS. Has Mr. Rand been to Europe to look over this thing firsthand, as you have been?

Mr. STASSEN. Not since he has been appointed, but he has traveled a great deal in past years and knows a great deal about it.

Mr. RICHARDS. Has he made a study of this particular setup over there or has he come in to just help you administer the thing, no matter what it is? Does he know anything about the mechanics of the operation?

Mr. STASSEN. I have found that he is learning very rapidly and that his judgment appears to be very good.

Of course, as you realize, in a change of administration and as sometimes by the decision of our people, it is then necessary for new men to become familiar with the program. That is the process that we are in right now.

Mr. RICHARDS. The thing that is worrying me more than anything else is that right here at the inception of these hearings you are going to be away and you know more about this thing-the administration angle of it-than anyone else. Your absence during the next few weeks will be felt.

Mr. STASSEN. That is a very good point, and I have thought of it very carefully.

The Near East and south Asia picture is of tremendous significance in what we are trying to accomplish in the Mutual Security Program. I wish we could have that age-old wish of being in two places at one time because I would like to be with the committee during these next weeks, and yet it is also clear that the Near East and south Asia picture insofar as the objectives of mutual security are concerned, needs conferences there.

I believe that I could have such confidence in the background of the experience of this committee and of the Senate committee that I would be certain that they will use good judgment in my absence, along with my able staff, and that I can better depend on that than I can leave uncovered my responsibility right now in the Near East and in south Asia.

It is a matter of judgment as to where it is most important for the mutual security objectives of the country that I should be at that particular time.

Mr. RICHARDS. And you don't carry Aladdin's lamp around with you to allow you to be in two places at one time?

Mr. STASSEN. Unfortunately not.

Mr. RICHARDS. I am sorry you can't be here. You will probably be back in a month?

Mr. STASSEN. In 20 days.

Mr. RICHARDS. Now, I want to ask you about this bill, about the form of this bill.

We have been trying around here for a good many years-I know we did last year and the year before-to get a composite foreign-aid bill and to stop the custom of each year writing important foreign-aid legislation by just amending preexisting legislation. The result has been that when the bill reached the floor it was very confusing to Members.

Now, we have here another amendment to the amendment to the amendment, and so forth.