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Mr. FLYNN. I do not think they are. I think this whole thing is a part of our foreign policy, and we have aroused in the minds of our · partners in this enterprise the expectation of getting these billions, and we cannot supply them. We have got to borrow 25 or 30 billions of dollars on the open market, at a moment when these other billions are maturing

Senator TUNNELL. You said it was too late to prevent Russia from having control of two-thirds of the resources and three-fourths of the territory of Europe.

Mr. FLYNN. She has possession of them now.
Senator TUNNELL. You said it was too late to prevent that.
Mr. FLYNN. That time has passed.
Senator TUNNELL. When was that time?

Mr. FLYNN. Well, I do not know when the time was passed. I do not know how far any commitments which we might have gotten out of Russia as a condition to giving her help when she was on her knees would have been honored by Russia.

Senator TUNNELL. I was referring particularly to the fact that we have been getting some help from Russia.

Mr. FLYNN. No; I do not think we have. I think Russia was getting help from us, as all the nations in Europe were getting help from us, and they were helping us to help them.

Senator TUNNELL. Then your position is that Russia has not helped in this war?

Mr. Flynn. I do not say that. I say she has helped herself in this war, and that as a consequence of that our task was made easier. But it was not so much helping ourselves as helping them.

Senator TUNNELL. Do you not think that the net result has been that we have been helped?

Mr. FLYNN. I do not agree with that, but I am perfectly willing to assume that. That is no reason why we should go on helping her to hold successfully millions of people that she has seized by conquest.

Mr. TUNNELL. I am taking your statement that the time has passed when we might have prevented Russia from having the control that she has in Europe.

Mr. FLYNN. Well, Senator, I am not prepared to say at what moment that time passed. I said before we got into the war that the war could have only one of two results; either Germany would win the war and dominate all the continent of Europe, or we would win the war and Russia would dominate the continent of Europe.

Senator TUNNELL. Which did you think was the preferable one?

Mr. FLYNN. I have no preference between them. I thought they were both brutal and abominable dictatorships, and I still think so.

Senator TUNNELL. You would have been just as satisfied if Germany had won?

Mr. FLYNN. I would not have been satisfied at all. I have no brief for Germany, but I do not see what is gained by spending our billions to take a man out of one prison and put him into another.

Senator TUNNELL. Do you think we are in just as bad a position as if we had not won the war?

Mr. Flynn. No. Once we got into it we had to win it, regardless of consequences. But we are in a worse position than if we had not gone into the war.

Senator TUNNELL. Do you think we had a choice as to going in or not going in?

Mr. FLYNN. I most certainly do. We decided to go in when we began to involve ourselves voluntarily in it. There were a great many honest and decent people who believed we ought to involve ourselves. They said we ought to be in this war. There were a lot of other people that were not so honest that said we ought to go into the war in order to protect ourselves from being attacked. We went into it, and the moment we went into it, it could have only one result, namely, that we would win the war. But before we went into it I said, and I think the fact has now been demonstrated, that if Germany won the war Germany would dominate Europe, and if Germany lost the war Russia would dominate it.

Senator TUNNELL. But if Germany had won she would have dominated the Western Hemisphere?

Mr. FLYNN. That, of course, Senator, I never admitted and do not admit now. I think it is a fantastic and grotesque assumption.

The CHAIRMAN. Thank you very much, Mr. Flynn. You can insert whatever you like in the records.

(The documents referred to and submitted by the witness are as follows:)

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TABLE 37.List of Wars, 1800-25

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TABLE 37.-- List of wars, 1800-85-Continued

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1 See table 31.
· See table 31.
3 Wars fought mainly outside Europe.

* Belgium declared independence Oct. 4, 1830. A preliminary treaty among the great
powers recognized this on June 26, 1831, but hostilities continued until 1833, and peace
was finally made in the Treaty of London, Apr. 19, 1839.

* Warsaw full sept. 7. 1931, The Polish insurrectionary forces did not surrender to the Russians but crossed the frontier into Prussia.

An amaesty for all Carlist political offenders was decreod on Bopt. 2, 1847.

? The war seems to have come to an end with the British withdrawal from Afghani

Vusto Jose de Urquiza, heading a coalition of Uruguayans, Brazilians, and Argentinians, defeated the Argentinian dictator Rogas at Casoros Fob, 8, 1862

The Stadtholders of the duches of Schleswig and Holstein nod o proclamation on Jan. 11, 1861, at Kiel.

O Tho Hardinian King Charles Albert, abdiented in favor of his son motor me manual for the Sardinian dafont by the Austriante al Novna, Mar. 1), 1x19.

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