feet. High grade timber of this species is estimated at about 4 percent of the total stand. British Columbia is therefore not in a position to export any quantities of high-grade Douglas fir logs because she is now importing American logs for a substantial amount of her requirements.

*

The position of Washington and Oregon as suppliers of high-grade softwood suitable for peeler logs is therefore unique. For this reason vessels from the four corners of the earth call at our ports for these choice Douglas fir logs. In view of the universal policy adopted by all other industrial nations of the world, restricting their softwood peeler log supply for their national industries, it would seem highly important that this country follow the same policy.

Mr. OXHOLM. I also wish to introduce a statement from the British Columbia Forest Service, showing the export of logs from that country.

Senator MCNARY. That may go into the record. (The document is as follows:)

Export of logs

THE FOREST RESOURCES OF BRITISH COLUMBIA, 1937, B. C. FOREST SERVICE,

Mr. OXHOLM. That shows the declining percentages of No. 1 grade logs.

I would also add to that statement by saying that British Columbia exports considerable quantities of high-grade Douglas fir logs of American origin. The reason for that is that Canada has trade agreements with certain countries, notably Germany, and the United States has not. Therefore, these logs are shipped to Vancouver and put on foreign vessels and shipped to these foreign countries.

I would like to make a statement in regard to the logs covered by this bill. We have called this bill the "peeler' log bill." By "peeler" logs, we mean logs that are suitable for the manufacturing of plywood in foreign countries. I wish to emphasize the point "foreign countries," because the specifications as used in competing countries have little or nothing to do with the specifications in the United States.

The grading standards covering logs of this character in the United States, state that a peeler log is a log 38 inches and over. Actual practice in our industry is 28 inches and over, and that limit is lowered every year. In comparison, in Europe softwood logs are usually between 10 and 12 inches in diameter. So naturally when we talk about a small log it does not mean much in the European sense because there are no softwood logs in Europe for peeling purposes which come up to our minimum dimensions.

That is a very important point, Mr. Chairman, because foreign countries do not care particularly about the large sizes we have. They want logs of 28 inches and thereabouts.

Now, if our industry is going to continue we must be assured of a continuous source of supply. If we don't have that, then we shall have to compete with industry in other parts of the United States. and in other parts of the world, with vastly lower labor costs and low grade raw material. We cannot make a high-grade finished product of poor raw material.

In regard to foreign countries, I want to emphasize the fact that their forest resources are being conserved by importing high-grade raw materials from us, and the day will come when our timber resources on the west coast are practically exhausted, that is as far as high-grade timber is concerned, and at that time some foreign country may export finished products to the United States.

Senator MCNARY. Do you think that reforestation, augmented by selective logging is of any aid in this matter?

Mr. OXHOLM. Yes; there are some that practice that now, but the new crops that come up will require a century or more before the timber is suitable for our purpose.

Senator MCNARY. Oh, not at all. Go ahead, I don't agree with that statement at all.

Mr. ОXHOLM. I have that information from the United States Forest Service.

Senator MCNARY. Well, I made a survey of this country years ago, and a number of bills have been based on that, and unquestionably the testimony indicated that our softwoods for use in the manufacture of shooks, rails, and poles, which was anywhere from 25 to 35 years' old, could be used, and by new processes of kiln drying, you can get the best kind of timber from 50 to 60 years.

Senator HOLMAN. You mean for plywood manufacture? That isn't what the plywood manufacturers say to me.

Senator MCNARY. I am speaking about the general use of Douglas fir, and hemlock and spruce-I am not talking about plywood.

Mr. OXHOLM. I was talking about an entirely different thing, I was talking about high-grade products that enable us to pay high wages, and when you get into poles and shooks and those things

Senator MCNARY (interposing). I thought you mentioned generally that you couldn't use any wood until it was a hundred years old. Mr. OXHOLM. I am sorry you misunderstood me; I am talking all the time about this bill.

Senator MCNARY. I thought you were discussing the subject generally, and I knew a little differently on that. Go ahead, it is my mistake.

Mr. OXHOLM. If there is any misunderstanding I would like to correct the record and say that my discussion is entirely limited to high grade softwoods of large sizes, suitable for plywood and similar purposes.

Senator MCNARY. It was my mistake, go ahead.

Mr. OXHOLM. Now, I would like to emphasize the difficult position that our industry is in in regard to dealing with foreign countries. The reciprocal trade agreement will never work out for our industry or any other industry, depending on large, high grade logs for raw material, as long as we make that raw material available to foreign competitors.

We cannot expect the State Department to negotiate with these foreign countries for lower duties or even parity, equitable rates of duty, because the foreign countries are just as desirous to protect their labor as we are desirous of protecting our labor.

We are the only country among the nations of the world, with a developed forest products industry, that permits that policy. Either all other countries are wrong, and we are right, or the other way.

To my mind there is no doubt about it, that we are absolutely wrong from the point of view of conservation, employment of our labor, and from the point of view of the future of our own industry.

In regard to conservation, I would just like to make this statement, that private reforestation is not possible without an adequate profit being made on the operation. The cost of reforestation must be paid by the income from the cutting of this virgin timber. That is the most profitable item we have, and we must string out the source of supply until the new crops become available.

I think the Chief Forester of the United States, Mr. Silcox, has stated that very well in his last annual report. He calls attention to the great danger of present cutting practice on the coast. We are overcutting and we are facing a depletion of our virgin timber and if that depletion occurs before the new crops mature, it means disaster to industry, and the same conditions as we find in the Lake States and other places where the virgin timber has been exhausted.

All I can say in conclusion is that our industry is a natural export industry. We have been able to pay high wages because we have excellent raw material. We have no complaint on that score, we have been able to compete in 50 countries in the world with countries with vastly lower labor costs, but not having the raw material. All we ask for is equality of opportunity to compete. We don't want any subsidy, and if we can't stand up on equal conditions with other countries, then we should get out of the business.

So here is an industry, Mr. Chairman, that has a natural possibility, it is an industry that grows by leaps and bounds, it has trebled its production in the last few years, but it must have raw material. I thank you.

Senator HOLMAN. Mr. Chairman, may I ask Mr. John Brophy of the Congress of Industrial Organizations, International Woodworkers of America, to speak. He has a brief statement he would like to make.

Senator MCNARY. Yes, indeed. Mr. Brophy, will you come forward and address yourself to a consideration of this bill?

STATEMENT OF JOHN BROPHY, REPRESENTING THE INTERNATIONAL WOODWORKERS OF AMERICA (AFFILIATED WITH THE CONGRESS OF INDUSTRIAL ORGANIZATIONS)

Mr. BROPHY. Senator, I wish to enter into the record a resolution adopted by the Plywood, Veneer, and Box Shook Council of the International Woodworkers of America, a C. I. O. affiliate. They held a convention in Portland, Oreg., on February 12, 1939, and they dealt with this question that is embodied in the bill before us now.

It support, in effect, this present bill. I don't think it is necessary to read it, if it can go into the record.

148445-39- -3

Senator MCNARY. It will be placed in the record. (The resolution is as follows:)

RESOLUTION

Whereas the States of Washington and Oregon possess the only appreciable stands of Douglas fir old growth timber suitable for peeler logs, and the State of Oregon possesses the only supply in the world of Port Orford cedar; and Whereas these timber resources which can never be commercially reproduced are a national heritage of the greatest value and afford the most important opportunity for employment of labor; and

Whereas the unrestricted exportation of Port Orford cedar logs and Douglas fir peeler logs has undermined the Northwest industries, depending on this raw material, has caused serious unemployment in the Northwest wood-convesion mills; and

Whereas a conservation cutting of these timber resources will constitute an economic incentive for reforestation enterprise, on which the future of the Northwest depends: Therefore be it

Resolved, That the Plywood, Veneer, and Box Shook Council of the International Woodworkers of America go on record to give the strongest possible support to cause a bill to be passed by Congress for the purpose of prohibiting the exportation of Douglas fir peeler logs and Port Orford cedar logs; and be it further

Resolved, That this matter be referred to the C. I. O. headquarters in Washington, D. C., soliciting its support in these endeavors; and be it finally

Resolved, That copies of this resolution be forwarded to the President of the United States, United States Senators, and Representatives.

Senator MCNARY. Do you desire to supplement that by any oral statement?

Mr. BROPHY. Yes; I have an additional statement I wish to make. An editorial, which appeared in the Timber Worker, March 11, 1939, and the Timber Worker is the official organ of the union, deals with the question of Foresters Ask Labor's Help in Conservation, and I think it is interesting that you know of this. The union expresses its support of intelligent conservation in relation to the care of this irreplaceable resource, peeler logs, and I will include this in the record with your permission.

Senator MCNARY. It may go into the record. (The editorial is as follows:)

FORESTERS ASK LABOR'S HELP IN CONSERVATION

The conference called in Tacoma last week by the Society of American Foresters holds particular significance for woodworkers. At this conference labor was represented, having for the first time been asked to cooperate in an issue of paramount importance to the Nation-the conservation of our timber resources. Also at this conference were representatives of log exporters, of the lumber operators, of the plywood manufacturers, and of the University of Washington. This was not a "boss" conference; it was a conference of people working for the use of American resources for Americans.

The Oregon section of the Society of American Foresters already has gone on record in support of the peeler-log and Port Orford cedar embargo as proposed by the International Woodworkers of America and embodied in bills in Congress. The Washington section will meet again next month and it is hoped that it will take similar action. Certainly it is to the interests of everyone that United States products be used here, with the benefit going to our labor and our industry, rather than to Hitler and the Mikado.

This is the first real effort to insure the processing of America's natural resources for the benefit of all the American people. In this case, an almost irreplaceable resource, peeler logs, is involved. It takes 150 to 200 years to produce one peeler log. The supply is diminishing. Woodworkers know what this means. The International Woodworkers of America will cooperate to the full in this worthy move to keep this product and this work in this country.

Mr. BROPHY. On behalf of the Congress of Industrial Organizations, I wish to express our support of the present measure, Senate bill 1108. This bill has the support of the International Woodworkers of America, a C. I. O. union, whose members comprise the workers in the lumber industry in the Pacific Northwest. Labor can join in the support of this legislation because its purpose is to conserve one of our most valuable natural resources and prevent its exportation to foreign competitors to the disadvantage of American workers and American industry. The export of this priceless, high-quality Douglas fir, in the shape of logs, directly affects the American plywood workers who are members of our international union.

There is a pay roll of more than $1,000,000 a year lost to our workers since Germany, Japan, and Italy have started to import our logs, making their own plywood and placing it on the world market.

We urge this legislation and ask that it receive favorable consideration by this committee.

This concludes my statement unless there are some questions. Senator MCNARY. Thank you very much, Mr. Brophy.

Senator HOLMAN. Is it in order for me to suggest further witnesses?

Senator MCNARY. Yes; but let me ask you, Colonel Greeley, do you desire to make a statement?

Colonel GREELEY. I would like to, sir, but when Senator Holman has concluded his side, I suggest you hear first from Mr. Clark who represents the Pacific Northwest Loggers' Association.

Senator McNARY. I can't continue this hearing very long this afternoon.

Senator HOLMAN. Our witnesses will take just a little while, as I understand, and he has to go, and will not be here again.

I, at this time, however, wish to introduce into the record, correspondence addressed by Governor Martin, of Washington, to President Roosevelt on this subject, and the President's approval of it in a letter, or at least a copy of a letter which I am told is a true copy, if I may submit that for the record.

Senator MCNARY. That correspondence may go into the record. (The correspondence referred to is as follows:)

His Excellency CLARENCE D. MARTIN,

THE WHITE HOUSE, Washington, March 18, 1939.

Governor of Washington, Olympia, Wash.

MY DEAR GOVERNOR MARTIN: I have personally considered the subject matter of your letter of March 1 dealing with the effect on labor and industry of exporting high-grade Douglas fir peeler logs.

I am very much in sympathy with the idea that exports of high-grade raw forest material, of which our domestic supply is limited, should not be encouraged. The continued existence of wood-using industries on the Pacific coast, particularly of the plywood industry, depends upon an adequate supply of high quality raw materials in the form of standing timber, a supply which is all too limited.

It is hardly necessary for me to assure you that I am in favor of sound proposals that redound to the benefit of American labor and industry. I am particularly impressed with the fact that organized labor is actively supporting the measures which have been proposed to protect its source of raw material upon which the pay rolls of industry are built.

Very sincerely yours,

FRANKLIN D. ROOSEVELT.