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So this additional well, even were there no substantial increase, would be necessary anyway, because only one of them is now operating at full capacity.

Mr. Hardy. Well, I had somewhere gotten the impression that instead of increasing governmental activities up there we were reducing them somewhat at Point Barrow.

Am I wrong in that?
Mr. Gavin. We had discontinued the entire operation, if I recall.
The CHAIRMAN. That was oil.

Mr. KELLEHER. I think, Mr. Gavin, that is the oil you are referring to, south of this area.

Mr. Gavin. What assurance do you have, if you drill this $400,000 well, you are going to get any gas at all?

Mr. KELLEHER. Oh, yes, the gas is there, 10 billion cubic feet of it. Mr. Gavin. You are assuming you are going

The CHAIRMAN. Wait 1 minute, Mr. Gavin. Mr. Hardy was examining.

Mr. Hardy. I am just trying to see if I can develop a logical picture of the situation here.

I had gotten the impression that actually there was some restriction taking place in the governmental installations up there.

Am I wrong in that?
Mr. KELLEHER. I am not aware of it, Mr. Hardy.

Mr. Hardy. I had understood that some of the Navy's installation was being reduced.

Mr. ('OHELAN. Will the gentleman yield?
Mr. HARDY. If anybody can answer the question-
Mr. PRICE. Mr. Cohelan

was up

there. Mr. (OHELAN. As a matter of fact, all that is up there is an Air Force operation, on an ACW operation, and the Naval Research Laboratory.

Mr. Hardy. That is exactly what I thought we had, that we had a very limited operation.

The CHAIRMAN. Captain Lovell, can you answer Mr. Hardy's question?

Captain LOVELL. Yes, Mr. Chairman.
Good morning, gentlemen.

The gas that is being produced up there at the present time and has been produced and used since 1950 is going into all federally owned installations in the Point Barrow area.

Now these include the Air Force installations, some of which may be classified, I don't know.

The Navy has the Arctic Research Laboratory there.
The Army has an arctic research installation.
The Weather Bureau has a facility.
The Federal Communications System, or Agency-
Mr. KELLEHER. Commission.
Captain LOVELL (continuing). Operates up there.
The Public Health Service operates a hospital.

The Indian Bureau of the Department of the Interior operates a school.

Mr. HARDY. They operate the school in Point Barrow for the natives, don't they?

Captain LOVELL. Yes, sir.

Mr. HARDY. I remember going to that school. I was trying to get a little education up there.

Captain LOVELL. Yes, sir. The principal reason for the increase-if you will excuse me just a minute here-is the fact that some of the Air Force installations up there who have been importing diesel fuel in drums or tanks all the way from the west coast at an atrocious price are going to convert their installations from diesel-burning installations to gas-burning installations.

Now this is where the principal increase in demand will come from. Now in addition, the school is being expanded to go through the high school. At the present time it is just a grade school.

Mr. Hardy. It does not take $400,000 to produce enough gas to supply one school, it?

Captain LOVELL. With all of these increases, it does take one additional well to safely meet the requirement that is programed, planned—it is a firm program right now, as to how much energy they will require.

Mr. HARDY. Well, we may need the thing.
But I am trying to understand what the basis for the need is.

And I had thought that there was being some curtailment in governmental personnel in the Point Barrow area.

Now I do not presume that this gas is being piped over any very long distance; is it?

Mr. COHELAN. He did not hear you.

Mr. HARDY. I say, I don't presume the gas is being piped any very long distance?

Captain LOVELL. No, sir.
Mr. HARDY. How long do you pipe it?
Captain LOVELL. About 5 miles.
Mr. HARDY. About 5 miles.
So that your radius of service is limited ?
Captain LOVELL. Yes, sir.

Mr. Hardy. Now what is the native population that is going to be served?

Captain LOVELL. 1,527.
Mr. HARDY. 1,527?
Boy, you've got an accurate count.
And what is the governmental population?
Captain LOVELL. I have to look that up, sir.
Mr. HARDY. (Aside to the chairman.)

The CHAIRMAN. What is the population now at Point Barrow, Government population?

Captain LOVELL. That is what I am looking for right here, sir.
I don't seem-no, here it is.
It is 66.
The CHAIRMAN. Şixty-six people there.
And the Government native population is 1,500; is that it?
Captain LOVELL. That is in the village itself, Mr. Chairman.

I do not have the figures here on the number of personnel at the military installations.

The CHAIRMAN. Now, then, one of the main reasons why you want this additional output of gas is due to the fact that diesel oil is being brought up from the States in barrels and you want to convert now to gas instead of that enormous expense; is that it?

Captain LOVELL. Yes, sir.

Well, these are plans of other agencies. These are not Navy agencies. The CHAIRMAN. I understand. Captain LOVELL. Yes, sir. The CHAIRMAN. I understand it. But you sell them the gas?

Captain LOVELL. At the present time we are saving the Federal Government about $500,000 a year in fuel costs by making this fuel available to them as gas, rather than requiring them to import oil from the mainland.

Mr. HARDY. The total military population is 66?

Captain LOVELL. No, sir. That is the total nonnative federally employed population in the village.

Mr. HARDY. Mr. Chairman, I withdraw any further questions.

But I do wish that I could get a little better understanding of this thing.

I frankly
The CHAIRMAN. I think so, too, Mr. Hardy.
But let's not

Mr. Hardy. I have been up here and seen the situation up there. It has been some years ago,

And I can appreciate the need for the use of gas there.

And I am thoroughly in accord of making it available to that 1,527 natives.

But when you talk about amortizing this thing in a comparatively short period of time, it has to be amortized through your Federal use and not the

Mr. PRICE. No.

Mr. HARDY. If you amortize a $400,000 gas well with 1,500 people using the gas, it is just crazy:

Mr. PRICE. That is what the testimony was.
The CHAIRMAN. Anyhow-
Mr. GAVIN. Will you yield-
The CHAIRMAN. We all understand-
Mr. Gavin. Mr. Hardy, would you yield?
The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Hardy hasn't the floor now.
I have got the floor.

Now all in favor of reporting this bill when your name is called, vote “aye” and all opposed vote “no.”

Call the roll. (Rollcall.) Mr. SMART. Mr. Chairman, on this vote there are 18 yeas and 4


The CHAIRMAN. A quorum being present, and 18 voting in the affirmative and 4 in the negative, the bill is passed.

And, Mr. Price, on behalf of the Armed Services Committee, I will as you to appear before the Rules Committee and obtain a rule.

I do not want etiher one of these bills put on the Consent Calendar.

I don't think they would look with much favor on a suspension of the rules.

Mr. HARDY. Mr. Chairman, I would like to make one observation.

The CHAIRMAN. And, so then take it up with the leadership and set these bills on the House Calendar, after you obtain a rule. Mr. Hardy?

Mr. HARDY. Mr. Chairman, I would like to serve notice I intend to oppose this bill on the floor, unless I get some explanation of this amortization.

The CHAIRMAN. Now the next bill

H.R. 11887

The CHAIRMAN. The next bill is H.R. 11887, to provide for the conveyance of all right, title, and interest of the United States reserved or retained in certain lands heretofore conveyed to the city of El Paso, Tex.

Mr. Price?

Mr. PRICE. Mr. Chairman, the purpose of this bill is to direct the Secretary of the Army to grant to the city of El Paso, Tex., a release as to the restrictions which presently apply to a parcel of land previously transferred to the city by the United States in a quitclaim deed entered into under the authority of the act of August 2, 1956 (Public Law 929, 84th Cong.).

The act of August 2, 1956, authorized an exchange of lands between the United States and the city of El Paso, Tex., on condition that the deed provide

(1) The city agree to construction by the Department of the Air Force of an interconnecting taxiway between Biggs Air Force Base and El Paso International Airport;

(2) The use of the airport by military aircraft; and

(3) That the property revert to the United States at the election of the Secretary of the Army for breach of any of the terms

and conditions by the city. In accordance with the authority provided the Secretary of the Army, the Secretary transferred three separate areas of land to the city of El Paso comprising a total of 2,255 acres of land. The three separate areas of land were designated as parcels A, B, and C. Parcels A and B, which aggregate approximately 2,214 acres of land, were contiguous to the airport and have been utilized by the city for the expansion of the airport. The remaining parcel C, comprising approximately 42 acres, and the subject of this legislation, is separated from parcels A and B and is located at the westerly edge of Fort Bliss along the Southern Pacific Railway.

The subcommittee was advised that the proposed interconnecting taxiway between Biggs Air Force Base and the international airport has not been built. Furthermore, it is most unlikely that this construction will ever occur. Therefore, it is extremely unlikely that a situation may develop in the future under which the reverter provision of the original land transfer could be put into effect.

Notwithstanding this situation, the bill proposes to eliminate only that much of the reverter provision as applies to parcel C—42 acres.

The reverter provision with respect to the balance of the acreage, 2,214, would continue in effect.

In addition to the reverter provision, by virtue of an ancillary agreement to the original deed of transfer, the Secretary of the Army added an additional restriction on the use of parcel C which precluded (1) its use for industrial purposes under circumstances which would result in the emission of smoke, noises, odors, or dust; and (2) that the city would, prior to leasing or disposing of the land comprising parcel C, consult with the Department of the Army.

Necessity for the legislation: The subcommittee has been advised that the city of El Paso has entered into a contract with the Southern Union Gas Co. for the sale of 8.358 acres, and that the company intends to erect warehouse and terminal facilities at this site. However, the prospective purchaser desires to obtain a clear title to the property without the reverter encumbrance.

The city therefore wishes to obtain a release from this encumbrance for the entire track in order to make it marketable for further development.

The Department of the Army advised that it had no objection to the bill providing that it is amended to include a new section which would (1) restrict the use of the property to purposes which will not result in the emission of smoke, noises, odors, or dust; and (2) prohibit the erection on the premises of any structure exceeding 500 feet in height: and (3) that the city pay to the United States the fair market value of the property interest conveyed.

In summary, this bill will simply repeal a reverter provision in the original conveyance, but would continue in effect existing restrictions on the use of the property.

In accordance with this departmental position, the subcommittee approved the legislation, with the amendment recommended by the Army.

The CHAIRMAN. Now, the amendments are set out in the bill?
Mr. PRICE. That is right.

The CHAIRMAN. Now, everyone understands what you are dealing with here.

Mr. Rutherford, is not this in your area?
Mr. RUTHERFORD. This is correct, Mr. Chairman.
Mr. RUTHERFORD. This is in my district.
The CHAIRMAN. Well, do you want to make any statement?
Mr. RUTHERFORD. Other than to say this, Mr. Chairman.

Iwant the committee record to be clear that the initial request for a transfer of this property was initiated by Fort Bliss, at the request and at the insistence of Fort Bliss.

And this was a matter of accommodation between the city of El Paso and the commanding general and officers at Fort Bliss.

We accept the reservations as outlined and recommended by the Department of the Army.

However, I do feel that a record should be made that in the opinion of the city of El Paso and in my own opinion, that the fair market value of the interest being conveyed, which is simply a reverter, relieving us of a reverter which affords us a marketable title, should be a nominal fee.

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